A post over at Odd Time Signatures by Karoli pointed to a Todd Cochrane post that was talking about a new SEO technique that was meant to game the tech A-list bloggers - either knowingly or otherwise.
Apparently the way it is meant to work is to release advance PR to a specific list of leading bloggers, get the bloggers to write reviews which is meant to build buzz, in these post the bloggers are paid to place specific links into the post and then when the A-List post hits Techmeme the linking pile on begins as does the the Google juice for the target of the post.
Like Karoli I have a really hard time believing that TechCrunch and other top tier blogs would stoop to dealing with this kind of practice - especially without disclosure. After all, the ad revenues alone wouldn’t be worth risking if people found out that TechCrunch or Mashable or Read/WriteWeb were playing such an underhanded game.
While there may not be such an overt practice of gaming the top tier the fact of releasing advance PR to top tier bloggers is in itself a method of gaming in that the moment these bloggers post anything they get linked to by every other blogger wanting to get some visibility; which also means increased page views and ad revenue as a result.
But then there is always the question of .. what if .. especially now that the very question has been raised.
Listening to: Traffic - The Low Spark Of High Heeled Boys - The Low Spark Of High Heeled Boys
Conversation Tags: blogs, blogging, A-List, PR, public relations
24 Comments
That’s not gaming. That’s successful PR, utilizing the blogosphere.
In traditional media, it’s not uncommon to offer an exclusive to, say, the Wall Street Journal, or eWeek. Then “everybody else” gets it. It’s even better with TechCrunch filling in for WSJ, etc.
Good for those folks in PR who have been able to make the jump and for those blogs considered prominent enough to target…
Personally Louis I would agree with you for the most part; but as with most things in life and profit there are and will always be cases where influence can and will be bought; or at least attempted to be purchased.
I’ve NEVER been offered money for a link, or to write a story, and if I were I’d turn it down.
If I didn’t turn it down for some reason I’d disclose that.
if someone offered to pay me to write a story I’d immediately post the entire conversation on techcrunch and burn them. No PR firm has ever tried that (they just wouldn’t) and only a couple of companies ever have (and I’ve immediately posted on it).
Robert,
As true as this may be Robert; and I do believe you when you say this, would you also agree or at least acknowledge the possibly that PR firms do in fact give preferential treatment to bloggers like you and Michael and that by doing so inadvertently or otherwise gain an advantage by the traffic you bring to the table.
Michael,
As surprised as I am to see you commenting here
I believe you when you say what you do.
However as I asked Robert do you think that PR firms who are always looking for an advantage however they can get it will target bloggers like yourself with advance PR info in order to gain the buzz that is associated with being mentioned by bloggers like yourself and Robert.
And also as a byproduct your revenue stream is increased by these advance PR info because of the added traffic that breaking news brings to the table.
So while the gaming via paid links etc maybe not something you would tolerate are you not in part being gamed by having this type of access.
I am not saying whether this is right or wrong because as Louis pointed out in an earlier comment this is the nature of the beast
.. I’m just curious on your viewpoint .. no more .. no less
Steve, I think you’re trying too hard here. There is no question that startups would love to reach TechCrunch before they e-mail you and me. So some may embargo all other blogs until TechCrunch publishes the story and gets the scoop. Then, when TechCrunch writes, those also writing get on TechMeme. That’s the process. It’s not a scandal. I can absolutely 100% verify that this happens.
>It’s not a scandal. I can absolutely 100% verify that this happens.
—–
Funnily enough that is good enough for me … as I said to Michael it more just a matter of my own curiosity along with my natural realistic and pragmatic viewpoint of the world in general.
Final comment for clarification… no good PR firm ever pays for placement, anywhere, and I’ve never seen that.
Absolutely PR firms try to get in front of me. But I still ignore 99% of them. Want to see the 5,000 emails from them? It’s pretty boring stuff.
But they don’t just come to one blogger anymore. They’ll soon be coming your way. So, what’s your answer going to be?
1. Will you go to a press conference or press dinner if invited?
2. Will you agree to hold any news until, say, next Monday at 10 a.m. in order to go to that press conference or press dinner?
3. Will you accept a free piece of hardware to write your review?
4. Will you accept a free dinner?
5. If you are told you’ll be given an exclusive that Mike Arrington isn’t going to get, will you accept any rules like “please keep this secret until 10 a.m. on Monday morning so we can make sure our servers are running when you blog it?”
Robert, I actually specifically did not mention you because I know you don’t advertise at all on the blog.
For the record, my specific question had nothing to do with embargoed stories, receiving free hardware/software to review, etc. It was specifically around the issue of paid links and whether or not there was some magic technique of linking to [something], whatever it might be, that would make them not be undisclosed paid links even though they were paid for.
My only beef with receiving free hardware/software to review is that I never get any.
I really have no criticism of that as long as there’s no obligation to be positive or negative and there’s disclosure…at the end of the day, it’s the disclosure thing that’s the center of the controversy.
Karoli: I watch the blogosphere for gaming behavior of all types (I’m working on a video where I talk about reverse engineering Techmeme, for instance) and I don’t see evidence of this. It’d be too hard to conceal and it would be disastrous to a blogger’s reputation if he/she did that. Any of the A listers now are making enough money where that’d be a HUGE disincentive to selling out.
As to why TechCrunch gets linked to on TechMeme even without having links to it, well, you’ll have to watch the video. I’ll have it up soon.
Totally unrelated to the conversation - great song. (Low Spark Of High Heeled Boys).
@Robert - you’re videos were good - if not a bit wine induced :), but I believe just about everything you said to be true and in line with what I’ve noticed. I didn’t ever think about the length issue, so that is interesting, but makes a certain amount of sense as most splogs will simply have something like 2 sentences then a link.
As for your questions to Steven above my answers I think would be:
1) yes.
2) probably.
3) probably, but I would say so in my post and make sure anything I said wouldn’t have to be positive.
4) yes, but again I would say so and again make sure anything I said wouldn’t have to be positive.
5) probably, but only because I’m a nice person - people have asked me to hold an embargo before and I’ve done it even when others break it - I don’t hold it for legality reasons per-se but rather because I’m not an asshole.
Robert - while I agree with some of what you say, I’m fairly certain that gaming in the blogosphere is going on - particularly with fake links and fake RSS numbers. There are companies, specifically in India, that set up fake blogs and will provide links for a fee. Technorati counts these links in their ranking. Gaming RSS is trivial and some blogs have done it and have been caught.
But payments from PR firms - no. I’d love for one of them to offer it. As I said above, it would make for great content when I posted the offer on techcrunch.
Steven - I’d separate the discussion into two different ones - first, taking payoffs once you are big is just dumb, no one would do it. But the second discussion is more interesting - doing completely unethical things to suggest that you are bigger than you are…well, someone should do an analysis of technorati links and feedburner stats at some point and post the results. The data is all just sitting there waiting for someone to go through it all.
Oh and regarding your question Steven about advance news under embargo - sure it happens every day. My rule is that I’ll post it if its interesting and if we get the news no later than everyone else. Then its up to us to write about it in an interesting way.
But embargoed news is just filler stuff. The way to win at what I do - part editorial, part breaking news, is to dig up the stories that companies don’t want covered and break that. That is all about building relationships and taking bits of information from different sources to put together a story.
Ross,
One of my all time favorite bands. I still remember buying the LP and playing it for the first time.
Michael,
I agree totally that the blogosphere is being gamed by the examples you give. Technorati is a good example of where this has happen. I have written about that before as well as wishing that Technorati would give us the users a method by which to remove that kind of linkage.
I know here I intentionally remove any pingbacks/trackbacks that link back to the type of blogs/splogs you mention. I have even done so if I feel that the linked blog is geared more to advertising than anything else - especially if it is just a screen scraping type reposter.
I do think that the problem becomes more prevelant the more popular a blog becomes and that at some point the time involved in policing your own comment stream for this type of thing is next to impossible. I know that I will continue to do so as long as I can. I consider it my part in trying not to add to this type of misuse.
And it definitely doesn’t hurt to have the day to day contacts that you have built up over time either
Michael - You don’t require first dibs? Everyone in the valley knows that to get on your site, you must get first dibs and are almost scared not to. I believe you about not taking paid links, but at least be truthful on your tactics you use on posts. The only time you follow say Mashable or RWW is when Duncan writes about it (and maybe now Eric). From all of the posts lately (scoble, winer, etc.), it seems the TC effect might no longer be what it once was.
All of these reasons and more is exactly why I wrote this post.
http://www.web-strategist.com/blog/2007/10/16/bloggers-stop-wasting-techmeme-real-estate/
Bobby: I know for a fact that Michael doesn’t require first dibs. He just requires being in the first group. You can have 100 people all briefed at the same time. As long as Michael goes out at the same time, he’ll be happy.
Now, the problem with giving an exclusive to 100 people is that someone will leak. Human nature. And if a leak happens before Michael gets to get his story out, well, then, you’ll lose the post on TechMeme (unless it’s really important, like a developer platform for Facebook or something like that).
That’s why PR people will tend to only brief those they trust to not burn their embargoes.
Robert - Bobby is a fake name, troll bait. But you raise an interesting point on embargoes breaking. When it happens, I don’t write about the story. The only reason for that is that the same guys break embargoes every single time, and it’s ridiculous that they continue to be trusted. Funny enough, it isn’t the blogs doing this, its the big guys. CNET and USAToday for some reason keep accidentally breaking embargoes. WSJ did it once. NYT never.
anywho, I’m done here. good thread.
Michael,
I would hope you would drop by for more that just one thread
2 Trackbacks
[...] intrigued by this concept, on WinExtra, OddTimeSignatures and Geek News Central today, that top bloggers might take cash for posts without [...]
[...] does foster an “echo effect.” This post is a case in point. It’s like one sees a bunch of people yapping about a television show you’re watching, prodding you to run over there and add your two cents - even if sometimes, it’s just [...]